How to Succeed on Tour with Katie Coleman

Today’s episode is a bit different than usual because instead of your host Katie Coleman interviewing a guest, we have George Psarras from City Lights Theater Company interviewing me! City Lights is a very special place that is near and dear to Katie's heart. One of her all time favorite theater experiences was when she got to music direct their production of Lizzie in 2017.

City Lights has their own podcast called Filament, which Katie was lucky enough to be featured as a guest on a few months ago. Today we are doing an episode swap In exchange for an upcoming interview featuring their executive artistic director, Lisa Mallette! Please check out the podcast Filament as well, for interviews, play readings, music and discussions.

Click here for more info about Filament and City Lights
IG: @citylightstheater
IG: @gtpsarras

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Theme music written by Rachel Dean and orchestrated by Katie Coleman

Audio engineer Mike Rukstad

Special thanks to the following folks from the SIX Boleyn Company for lending their voices to the intro:

Mike Rukstad

Dylan Dineen

Sarah Ortiz

Jane Cardona

Kaitlin Ciccarelli

Kami Lujan

Jillian Bartels

Transcript

 Here we are, we're live, live, we're not live, we're recording, right? I'm gonna cut all this BS out. Except maybe that. That was kind of funny. This is gold. This is...

So how are you? I'm good. I feel like I haven't seen you in... Since 

New Years. That's true. It was New Years. But that was like five months ago now. 

Or four. And you were on a break from your tour at that point, right? 

Yes, we had three weeks off. Not... For Christmas, but starting the day after Christmas. We had three weeks off, but I think did you have a Christmas show?

Yeah, we had an evening show on Christmas. And how was that 

audience? Good. 

It was good. Just um, you know They all blend together Also our Experience particularly the band Well, I think everyone's experience of the show was it was hard to Feel too much from the audience because we're wearing in ear monitors Sure, so and just 

to clarify just to clarify we're talking about the tour six You were the music director for the national tour of six and um, and you played Over how over how many months?

Six months six months actively on tour. Sure. And how many cities? It was 14 cities and then I've since been backed on two more cities to cover like personal days and vacations and stuff. Sure. So 16 cities. 

And those are big venues, going back to what you're talking about, you're talking about you guys had inner monitors so you're pretty much closed off to 

any sort of reality out there.

Yeah, and they did have to, they did put a microphone in the audience so that we could hear. Applies, but it was very controlled. So our, our mixes were very controlled. So it was hard to really tell, like, it was hard to tell the difference between a really good audience and a not so great audience or a really big audience.

Um, but generally audiences love the show. Like they were all good audiences. 

Yeah. I, um, I. I mean, everybody who talks about that show just has great things to say about it. I wish I could have seen yours. Yeah. I haven't, I haven't, I haven't seen it yet, but it's on, but it's all like, there's all kinds of tours around.

There's like cruise ship tours and this is the, this is the national. Equity tour or non equity? What was it? It's 

equity. So right now it's still all equity. Um, this was the second national tour. So they, so six like famously opened the night of on Broadway, the night of the shutdown for COVID. So, Oh my God.

Yeah. Really? Yeah. So their opening night was like March 13th or whatever. And, um, so then they closed down and any plans that they had to run or have tours just got scrapped at that time. And then they reopened I believe a year and a half ago about, um, on Broadway, on Broadway, like beginning of 2021. Wait, 2022, I'm, don't quote me on any of this, but, but then they launched the first national tour fairly soon after that.

And the first national went, did longer sit downs at the really big cities. So they like went to Boston for six weeks and Chicago. LA and San Francisco or they're, they're going to LA next, but they're doing the, the really big cities for longer runs. And then they launched our tour just like maybe six months after it's the second national.

And we did, um, slightly smaller cities, but still full X, full union tour, um, like the highest tour contract, I think that there is. And, um, we did big cities, but they weren't the biggest cities. And we did one to. One to three weeks and, and that tour is still going. It's the Boleyn tour is the one that I was on.

Gotcha. So the first one was Aragon, who's the first queen and then ours was Boleyn. So we'll see what, whether Seymour's next or not. I 

see. Cool. Well. Yeah. Man. That's cute. Is there any chance, are you done done with 

that? Um, no. I'm, I'm, I still feel very much a part of the Six family. Um, as I mentioned, I've gone back to cover personal days and vacations on my tour, which is really fun to do.

And um, I likely will be put in rotation on Broadway as well. 

Really? Yeah. That's exciting. I know, that is exciting. Um. And which theater are they in? 

It's at the newly renamed Lena Horne Theater. Oh. On West 47th. Uh huh. I do not recall what it used to be called, but they just 

renamed it Lena Horne. Sure.

That theater had enough years as something else. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So how did you get, how did you get six? 

Well. I, I feel as though it's going to be a disappointing answer to all of the listeners, 

because there is no such thing. 

It's frustratingly random how I got this 

gig. I don't think, see, to me, that's not, that's not, that's not, that gives one hope, that's what I would say.

This is true, absolutely. Because there are so many things. As you know, Katie, in like, the gig lifestyle, there's like, there's so many things that are out of our hands. Yes. And like, Entirely. What, what is this quote that I keep forgetting, but yet I seem to live by? Preparation meets opportunity, or something like that, right?

It's true. You're so great. You study, study, study, you work, work, work, and then... A door opens right? So that this is not frustrating. 

Okay, and it's all who you know This industry is all entirely who you know, so 

Right, and I think I think that quote is kind of misleading because people are like, oh, you know this person That's why you got this great gig.

Yeah, but I was able to walk through the door and follow through and like all the preparation and, and, and, and all the work that I've been doing for X amount of years helped me get this job. Yeah, the door opened and yeah, it seemed kind of random or whatever, but you also have to deliver. It's not just who you know.

The people you know, yes, can get opportunities, but if you're not good enough to follow through on that job, see you later. 

You know, and the only reason I know those people is because of other things I've done. So, yeah, so basically, um, a year or so ago, I started subbing on Broadway, playing keyboard two on Aladdin.

And I got that job because, uh, 15 years ago at this point, I believe it was like 2008. I subbed on Wicked when it was in San Francisco. It was there for about a year and a half and I was one of the piano players. Like I did rehearsal piano and um, performance, like did the keyboard four part. Right. Um, oh no, actually.

So it did not have to do with Wicked. So I did Wicked and then a few years later I did the same thing for Lion King. Lion King came through, um, and I subbed on keyboard. Like I wasn't even the main keyboard player. I just was one of the subs. But I. You know, this was what I was doing with my life. And so I was trying to, to meet all the people that I could meet.

So I emailed or got in touch with the music director of Lion King who, you know, was conducting the show every night, but I specifically reached out to him and asked if he'd wanted to meet up and grab a drink and talk shop. So we did. And his name is Jamie Schmidt and he's currently one of the associate music directors on Aladdin on Broadway.

So fast forward, when I moved to New York, moved back to New York in 2020. Jamie and I were in touch, he knew that I had moved back to the city, and so we got in touch again and just kind of stayed in touch a little bit, and he asked if I wanted to be a keyboard sub on Aladdin. So then I became a keyboard sub on Aladdin, and in the process of doing that, I met another keyboard sub on Aladdin.

And it's David's last name. 

David Smith. 

So in the process of sub playing keyboard for Aladdin, I met David Kruppel, who was another keyboard sub on Aladdin. And he is 

better.

Sorry, David. Um, David

is Yeah, he is deeply involved in like the Disney shows and David goes way back as old friends with Roberta Dutok, who is the music supervisor of Six. So shortly after David and I met, um, Roberta reached out to him and asked if he knew, had any recommendations for music directors, associate music directors for the tour.

And he recommended me. And that's cool. 

So music supervisors in theater, uh, they, they do all the hiring in terms of personnel. 

Yeah. Music supervisor is kind of like the new name for a music director. So music supervisor means like the music director of like the entire show. Sure. If even if there's like multiple productions.

So like Roberta supervises all of the. Like the six broadway and the two tours and then also has some hand in the cruise ships. Um, so she Does all of the hiring, but then also works very closely with a contractor. And I think with some of the bigger shows, uh, the music supervisor will definitely hire like the keyboard players, the drummer, and then likely reach out to contractors to get names of other people.

So they work kind of hand in hand. And then I also, um, she did ask for my input regarding the band for the tour. So she and I worked together to. Choose the band as 

well. And you held those through like open auditions or 

no, no They're it these jobs never get posted Really just yeah, I think it was all so so 

somebody has like a Rolodex of Like good ringer pit musicians.

Yeah 

There was so there were five of us. So it was keyboard guitar bass drums, and then I had an associate music director so five of us in the band on tour and the associate was a friend of a friend of mine. So I just got her name and, and of course, like we watch videos and you know, Roberta interviewed everyone.

And then our drummer was one of the Broadway subs and our guitar player was also one of the Broadway subs. And then our bass player, I think knew, like was friends with the bass player of the Aragon tour. So it was like kind of just. People that we had heard of and Sure. We watched like their reels or whatever, and Roberta interviewed them.

And 

how did you, like, how did you like being on tour? 'cause I know it's, it's not for everybody. I mean, you're either on a bus or a plane, you're in a different city every couple days, I assume. No, because you're doing like a, a, a run of like, how long would a run last in a, a city, two or three weeks? Yeah, 

we did at least one week everywhere and then three weeks at most yeah And they actually have some like five week Stays coming up so and we flew almost everywhere So we did take buses occasionally, but that was like when we were going to super close that were close to one another right?

Um tour was A rollercoaster, it was, it was very high highs and some low lows. It's really, it's, it's very much, it's a very specific life. Like your life is sort of handed to you. It's like, here are the people that you're going to be with. Here's the places you're going to go. And it's really nice in a lot of ways, because you don't have to decide anything.

You're just like, just tell me where to go. You have a 

call sheet or anything. 

And, um, but at the same time, you don't, you're choosing that life, but you're not choosing the people or the places. Um, so like, I didn't have any personal connection to any of the cities that we went to, which was a little hard for me, you know, I, and not that it was hard, but I just, I saw other people who like went to college.

In a city we went to or grew up in a city we went to. And that was so, so fun for them. And they had like so many people that they knew come, but I didn't really have any personal connection to any cities, although we did go to some really great cities and I have mostly positive things to say about all the places that we went.

Um, and it, I think the thing that is challenging is. Working with the same people that you're living with and socializing with like it just was a bubble and Everyone was absolutely incredible. I mean we are we're so lucky They are so lucky is such a great group of people like really I don't have a bad thing to say about anybody on that Tour everyone was so great But but it's like the same 30 people and that's that's who you're with At all times.

All the time, right. Yes. And working with them, and like going to check out museums, and going to eat, and going to parks, and going to, down time and on time, yeah. Right. 

So you're like staying in an Airbnb with them maybe, or um, yeah, just doing, doing all the things with them. And then, and not with like. Your people.

So like, I, you know, I'm sure 

that gets rough. Did anybody like splinter off and be like, I need a break from you people to go family or friends or whatever. And it's, Oh, absolutely. I think that. I mean, I think it's natural. It's 

necessary. Right. And, and everyone was really good at, at that. And I think part of that was too, because it was mostly women, which was just fantastic.

It was so cool. But everyone was really good about being really honest about like where, where they were at that day. So you could totally be like, I'm kind of lonely. Like, what are you guys up to? Or whatever. Say, Hey, I just want to go home and like fudge out. I just want to go back to my room and have like a down, down night to myself.

And I think you get really good at recognizing that. I think that I actually grew in that way. Um, throughout tour of like understanding, Oh, okay. Like I, tonight is a night. I just want to go back to my hotel room and do nothing. Or like, I'm really lonely. Like, who can I call? And. Everyone was very inclusive.

Like there was always someone you could hang out with if you needed to. Um, and I did have a lot of visitors, which was really nice. I think my mom came to visit like four times. Oh, um, I had, I had mo I think more cities than not. I had like a friend come or a friend come see the show. And so, especially given that I didn't have any personal connection to any of the cities, I think I was really lucky in that way.

That's great. And you guys had like. Two show days, or what were your weeks like? Eight show weeks? Yeah, it was 

eight, eight show weeks, um, usually double Saturdays, double Sundays. It was typical, like, Broadway schedule, um, Tuesday. So, yeah, a typical, a typical week we would travel on Mondays. Um, so we didn't really get a day off.

Uh, and then you would, like, get to the new city, like, Monday afternoon, and so the crew is busy loading in the show on Mondays, but the band and the cast was... You know, we got to our hotel room, we go, go grocery shopping, kind of settle in and then Tuesday morning or exploring or relaxing. And then it was always soundcheck at five 30 on Tuesday, or I guess at five o'clock we would have a meeting, like a full company meeting, kind of introducing you to the venue and checking in about anything special that week.

And then a soundcheck at five 30. And then we'd have our first show at seven 30, Tuesday night. And then it was Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. And then two shows Saturday, two shows Sunday. That was the typical schedule. And then we would rehearse usually one to three times. A week as well 

really just like brush up stuff trouble spots or what?

What would you call this? Would you call those rehearsals? 

At first it was understudy. So we had we it's six six women in the cast and four Alternates and the four alternates each cover three roles. Uh huh. So they had to learn their their tracks so that was a lot of the rehearsals and they get at least one to two rehearsals a week and then we would do like a Brush up with the onstage Queens.

Um, maybe once every couple of weeks. Cause we also had visiting staff. So a resident director and a resident choreographer would come, come once a month and check and watch the show and then give notes and have like one on one time with everyone or group time brushing up on things. And would 

you have a lot of like understudy swing things happen?

Yeah. 

We not so much at first, but But yeah, uh, the, the alternates work really hard when 

it's a bad burrito and then 

there was, there was some, um, an oyster incident that 

kind of went, hold on, let's roll this back. What city named the restaurant? We want the cook's name. We want everybody where the oysters from.

Are we talking, are we talking Seattle based oysters, Connecticut? 

I can send you the news article because it was actually my mom who found it, but it was New Orleans. So New Orleans was the best city that we went to. My favorite tourist stop, like by far, New Orleans is a magical place that I cannot wait to go back to.

And we all had a really great time. It was kind of a rough city because it was so much fun. Oh my gosh. So I think that's not like yes, you can see 

it out. Right. Yeah. Couple of hurricanes and then do a show. 

Yeah, exactly. And the hotel that most of us were in was literally on Bourbon Street, like on the corner of Bourbon and Canal.

So we're right in the thick of it. 

Now, I've never been, but they say the hurricane, like not the actual hurricane, there's a drink called a hurricane, isn't there? Yes. That's what I've heard. That's what I've heard. 

Exactly. And the food is amazing. The live music is just. I mean, New Orleans is so much fun. Uh, and we really had to pace ourselves, but, um, that, and we, there were a lot of visitors that week to a lot of people had friends and family come.

And, um, so that's just got sick. We're sick in general, just cause it was a busy week and it was November. I think it was like the last week in November. So it was also just kind of a, a time of year when you get a lot of colds and whatnot, um,

Okay, so you're walking down Bourbon Street, it's dinner time. 

So, I'm trying to think of how it all played out, but basically, like, one by one, we started to lose people to, like, some sort of weird stomach bug. And it happened to one of our stage managers kind of early in the week, and then... Someone else like a couple of days later and I went to dinner and, um, my, my partner and his good friend came to visit and we went to dinner with another girl with a show and all four of us, and this was like the Saturday night before we left, um, all four of us ended up with some sort of stomach issues the next day and it just, it worked its way through the company and I, and then like a month later, my mom found this news article that was like.

All the oysters in New Orleans don't eat the oysters. Oh, you're kidding. And it was like multiple states. It was like Texas. They named a bunch of states where it was just like a bad batch of oysters. Wow. Yeah, but we survived. 

That's nuts. And this is all through, you know, COVID times too. Right. Are you guys like still on a rigorous testing schedule or?

We were not, they actually, ironically, like the week after I finished my time on the tour was when they stopped requiring masks backstage. But all through the first six months of the tour, we were testing regularly, which looked like at least once a week to every other day, depending on like the risk level and then all masked backstage.

Um, luckily we were, we were not masked on stage. I think some of the band, like sometimes the band might be masked, but not the Mm hmm. How about we, we did no masks the whole time. So that was really nice. Um, but it was a lot, you know, just a lot of COVID protocols. And then also like we couldn't have visitors backstage and it was a little harder to intermingle with the community and, and outside outsiders.

And how are the audiences? Oh, so good. I mean, everyone loves the shows. It's, I was always so fun. So I was saying before about the, the in ear monitors made it a little bit hard to hear the audience, but we could see the audience really well. Um, 

did you guys have video monitors? 

Well, we were on stage, the band's on stage.

Oh yeah. Killer. In costume. Yeah. It was so fun. And you know, like the first, Oh yeah. You could, you could see. It's like everything from the front, the front couple of rows. Um, and usually this was kind of interesting. So the first night or two in every city was usually subscribers. So that was sometimes less energetic audience than by the end of the week, you get more fans.

Yeah. So that was kind of interesting. Um, one of my favorite things was like to see a couple of people in the audience who towards the beginning of the show seemed a little bit skeptical, but then by the end are like on their feet and clapping along and dancing and cause it's that kind of a show.

Rapid fire. Which city had the best food? New 

Orleans. 

New Orleans. Well, I mean. Sort of. 

Well, right. Just don't eat the oysters. Except for that one week. But I did have some of the best food of my life on tour. And New Orleans was, I would say, the top. The top for the best food. But, um, I also, I mean... So one thing that I learned, or one thing that I'm coming away with, is feeling like the country is geographically bigger than you realize, but culturally smaller.

So every 

city, like, What, say more about that. 

I, I really felt like every city was welcoming and, um, just, there was less difference in the people that we met in every city than one might expect. Sure. Um, yeah. And, but we would, you know, take a flight for four hours to get there. And it would, I know that this is kind of funny, but we did a fair amount of shopping.

Like there's like, you know, gift shops and fun little shops in every city. And that was a good way to pass the time. And we would see like the exact same items in so many shops across the country. So even though you're like, Oh, it's this cute little unique independent store, they have like the same. Items as the one that you were, you know, the city beforehand.

So that was always kind of interesting. And, but yeah, the food, food wise, New Orleans, Nashville was another city that we went to that had 

big music city. You know, we have threatened to come out there for Nashville. And I really wanted to see Nashville. So 

far. I know I want to go back there. 

That's cool.

How long were you in Nashville? A week. Did you go to Memphis? 

No, that would have been fun. I think they might go there that our tour might be going there at some point, but we 

didn't Um best city to have the most to spend your downtime other than New Orleans Though we will accept that 

answer Well, New Orleans was like the biggest, I would say New Orleans and Nashville were the biggest cities, so it felt like there was a lot to do.

We also went to Vegas, which I have to say was the most disappointing. 

Oh right, your tour opened in Vegas, didn't it? Yeah, we opened in 

Vegas. 

And how was Vegas disappointing? In what way? I 

think Vegas is fun for a weekend when you're on vacation. But we were staying at like a Hampton Inn that was not close to anything.

Yeah. Um, we were, we actually had rental cars. So, so there's like union rules about how far you, your hotel can be from the theater and whether or not that means you can get a car or not. So this was one where there weren't really any hotels close to the theater. Cause we were not in a casino. We were at the Smith center, which was like a big theater.

Not on this trip. And there aren't really any hotels there. So they put us at this Hampton Inn, which was like a 10 minute drive away. But there was nothing within walking distance of the hotel. There was an in, it was an in and out, like catty corners. You could walk to the in and out, but then there was nowhere else to walk.

So that just makes it hard for me. Like I'm, I'm like a get up and walk around kind of person, even if I have a car. For sure, an explorer. Right. Yeah. 

Exactly. We used to play the Las Vegas Greek Festival. And we stayed way off the strip. Uh. Yeah. Because it was on the church grounds. Um. Uh huh. But then after we, we did it for like six years.

We, we stayed. We, we got, we got wise and we started staying on the strip and then driving to that thing. So that way we could spend our, whatever off time we had, you know, we'd come in a day earlier and stay a day after. Right. Stuff like that. At least we're yeah in and around the walkable action, you know, yeah, 

I really feel like I Now know how to tour now that i'm done touring.

I know how to do it and I think maximize your time and stuff Yeah, where to stay Right. The people that tour for years, they really figure it out. Like they know when to get Airbnbs versus when to get hotels and... 

Wait, so you're in charge of where you stay? 

Well, so you get a choice. So the company offers you two different hotel options.

Okay. And you can always opt out of that. So it depends on the contract, but the contract that we were in, we were paid... a per diem covered, supposedly covered hotel and food. So then you could opt into whatever hotel they offered, but then you are still paying for the hotel. There's other tour contracts where they pay for the hotel and then just give you per diem for food.

But, um, we could always opt out of the hotel and get our own Airbnb. So I did Airbnbs in like three different cities, um, but mostly hotels. 

And they'll cover their Airbnb up to a point. They'll give you a limit. 

It's like a, so they give you a hotel option, but then at the end of the week, you're still paying for it.

Your hotel's 

not 

covered for the tour? It's as, it's part of your per diem, but then your per diem is just paid directly to you. I see. Yeah, our per diem, and this is a big, there's All these negotiations right now with equity, um, for the tour and contract because hotels and food have gotten a lot more expensive and the per diem doesn't necessarily always cover it.

So that's a big, um, discussion happening. Discussion point, 

yep. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you used to play in the Hamilton tour in San Francisco. Was this in between your New York stints? Yeah. Because you were like, you moved to New York, then you moved back, then you moved back to New York. I 

am all over the 

place, George.

I know you are. But, but it's, it's those, it's those moves that like lead to these opportunities. You have a, you have a good sense of when you need to go, when you need to stay. And 

yeah. Um, so yeah, as I said earlier, I had played for Wicked and Lion King and some of the bigger shows that had come through San Francisco.

And then I moved to New York and. 2018. It's actually shortly after we did Lizzie and I met you guys at City Life. 

Which is when we met in, we met, we did Lizzie in 2017, the summer. 

Yeah, so it was like the spring after that I moved, that I was, I was basically offered, you probably remember this, but I was offered a room In my friend's apartment here in Astoria, um, like her roommate was moving out.

So she said, Hey, you want to come like move to New York? And I had been kind of toying with the idea. Also the rent was like a third what I was paying in Mountain View. So I said, yes. And I moved out here. It was like March of 2018. And then I was here for the summer. Um, I actually, well, I actually came back to do Hedwig and the Angry Inch at San Jose stage that summer, but then came back to New York.

And then, um, I was once again, going back to San Francisco to do Mary Poppins at SF Playhouse. And like a week before I left for that, I got this email from the San Francisco contractor saying, Hey, are you interested in, um, auditioning for. To be a part of the Hamilton team in San Francisco. So I said, yes.

And like, put all my stuff in storage. Cause I'm like, I don't know if I'm coming back. Um, cause I knew it, it started cause Hamilton started like in February. So I was going to go, I was going to be there like December through January. So I'm like, I don't know if I'm coming back. And I like locked myself in a room for a week and practice Hamilton, like crazy.

And I had to audition for that and then, um, ended up getting it. And this is a 

Keyboard 2 part, or what was it? 

So that was a, it was like a music. 

Oh, you were rehearsing them, weren't you, or something? 

Yeah, I was doing both. So I was, um, would play some performances and then rehearsals. Right, so just like part of the music team.

There were like four or five of us that shared all of the duties But 

either way you had to know the show front to 

back. Yeah. Yeah And I had to audition for that and the audition also involved like rapping while playing which was crazy And I 

can't because because you had to teach that you mean 

Yeah, so that's a fun fact about Hamilton is that it's choreographed to lyrics, not counts, for the most part, so somebody in the room has to be saying the lyrics at all times, basically, and that is the job of the pianists, as well as, like, the choreographer, whoever's teaching, but, um, they do But 

there's still a specific amount of bars that that lyric has to fit in, right?

Oh, yeah, it has to be in time, so you have to be able to, like, Like, at a moment's notice, be like, okay, Katie, you cover, you know, Hamilton and Burr, like I'll cover Angelica and Eliza or whatever. Oh, wow. 

Or just like So you really have 

to know the whole thing. Yeah. And you're, you're looking at the music, so you don't have to have it memorized, but that I mean, that requires so much hand eye coordination.

Oh, forget it. It's the hardest thing I've ever done. Really? It's so hard. You basically have to get one of them in muscle memory, so you have to, like, kind of, you Memorize the entire show, like every lyric to the show, um, which a lot of people have that show memorized, but, and then also be able to play this very complicated.

Piano part. So that took me the entire run of Mary Poppins at SF Playhouse. I was, I would go to a practice room for like three hours a day and practice Hamilton and then play Mary Poppins. Um, and then this other crazy thing happened. So a few weeks, like, A month, maybe a month before Hamilton was supposed to start up.

Um, I got asked to go on tour with Falsettos briefly. So I then, and Mary Poppins had closed. So then I went and toured with Falsettos for, I ended up doing that for like a couple months. Um, and starting up with Hamilton later. That was kind of this weird extra gig that got thrown in there, but that was another little tour experience.

And then I did Hamilton for about a year in San Francisco, um, and that got shut down for COVID. And then I stayed there for a while until I decided to move back here in November of 2020. Right. During the shutdown. Wow. It was a crazy time. 

And, and Hamilton, not to get into the weeds, but I'm interested in this and you're interested in this.

So, I mean. Sure. We're both musicians. So, we're talking about, like, what I'm interested in, like, the difference between playing, like, the six score and then playing the Hamilton score. Are they both to click? And are they both, like, Within an inch of its life. You have to like fit all this stuff. It is everything like pre Yeah, good question.

I'm not asking this very nicely. I mean, I might rerecord I might rerecord my question But you know what i'm saying is everything like technically fit in within an inch of its life in the score 

Yeah, so playing hamilton really helped prepare me. Well, it helped me prepare me for any Challenge in life.

It's most, most challenging thing I've ever done, but, um, Hamilton. Yes. But it really prepared me for six because both are done to click 

mostly. And for those that don't know what we're talking about, a click track is something that let's say, um, uh, a piece is specified to be 120 beats per minute. That means there's literally its own track going click.

Click to and everybody in the pit is hearing the click if they choose to but definitely the band leaders hearing it And that's to keep everybody 

Right. It's like a metronome in your ear. Yep. Um, and both Hamilton and Six have some elements of a track that's also playing. So, we're hearing a click, but that So, pre recorded.

That click is, yeah, coincides with some pre recorded music or sound effects Right. That the audience hears. Um. And so it all has to be timed exactly right. And in Hamilton, it is the percussionist who triggers the click most of the time or all of the time. Um, and, and like the tempo does change. So there's, there's a lot of starts and stops with the track 

throughout.

And does he start and stop that? Like if there's like a train track, there's railroad tracks, right. In between two pieces that are dynamic, that are the tempo are vastly different. Does the, does the. Well, I guess the music director who might cue the percussionist be like 

go right so it's uh, yeah, you're never stopping it So it's always set to a specific amount of time So again, like you can't get off of it because it's also triggering other things.

So it's not just okay. Here's our tempo It's like I am starting this track and that will have like a specific specified number of measures and it might be cued For Hamilton like some of those might be cued by the conductor or it's just baked in so it's like okay on beat 3 I I hit this Yeah. Trigger.

Yeah. Um, yeah. And six is like that as well. There's a little bit less like starts and stops and a little less, uh, like there's fewer slowdowns in the music say it's, it's kind of, cause it's, Hamilton is 50 songs. Six is like 10. Whoa. Or maybe 15. Uh, yeah. So there's just a lot less music in six. It's also a lot shorter.

It's only an 80 minute show or as Hamilton's like almost three hours. So, so yeah, Hamilton definitely prepared me for six, but, um, for six, it's the music director who triggers the, and the tracks. Yeah, so six is, and the keyboard part for six is much easier to play than the key, than either of the keyboard parts for Hamilton.

Which makes sense. 

Lin Manuel, man, he's just stacking it. 

Yeah, and Alex 

Lacamoire. so 

rich. Yes, Alex Lacamoire is a famously incredible pianist and he wrote the piano parts for Hamilton. Um, Six is more modeled off of pop songs as opposed to hip hop. So there's just like a lot, it's different styles. Um, and as music director, what was, was challenging for me and Six wasn't so much the piano part.

It's more the choreography of it all. So I had to start, start and stop the. Track and the click and that half that would happen like in the middle of conducting things So there were times when you would count. Oh also I had a microphone Where I could speak to the band and the cast so I did count offs So the cast also has in ears in your monitor, so they're hearing just my voice, right?

That's pretty common They do not yeah, they don't hear them In all live 

acts, right? They're hearing the music director go, you know, chorus, even. 

Yep. It's like pop concerts. Verse, chorus. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So the band would hear me count off and the click and the cast would hear count offs, but no click.

But then we're also hearing whatever mix you want in those in ears. Right. Everybody gets their own mix. Mm hmm. Yeah, more or less. Um, so I would have to do things like say like one, two, three, four But on three I'd press the track start. So you're hitting a 

spacebar on a computer. 

Basically. It was it was like a go button 

Oh, go button.

Cool. Yeah. So one, two, and then three you're training your body to hit the, to start the train on 

One and then there were other times when I would hit the track on one but have to count three four So it's like little things like that 

And do they did you have to find those little just somebody tell you you need to click go on one It's 

all in the music.

That's great. It's all written Yeah It's already not you you have to kind of get used to the tempos so that you can especially if you're saying one two and Then hitting three four you need to know what tempo you're setting up for three four You know, that part was, was very laid out. The music is very well written.

Um, the, so the, they thankfully don't make the music director play memorized, but the other, because we're on stage, the guitar, bass and drums are supposed to play memorized and did. So that was another very cool thing that they were able to do. 

Cool. Yeah. What's, what's next for you? Um, 

good question. Well, And just to touch on that bopping back and forth and tour in general, um, I think tour was kind of the ultimate.

So we all sacrifice a lot in our lives for our careers as artists because we love what we do so much. And um, tour was kind of like the height of that for me. It's like basically you put your life entirely on hold so that you can focus on your career. And I always was curious about touring, but I. I knew I didn't want to tour for a really long time.

Some people just love touring and just want to do it for years. And it's a great, you know, it's a very stable job. It's a very stable job in the arts, which is hard to come by. And, um, after so much back and forth, you know, I had moved back. It right after COVID, I had moved back to New York and really committed to New York.

I was, I like got a new driver's license. Like I got like a New York ID right away. I registered to vote right away. I got health insurance right away. Like a lot of people don't do this for years. They're like, Oh, I'll get around to it. But I was like, no, I'm living in New York. I want to be here. Like this is what I'm doing.

And then of course I got asked to go on tour. And, um, I knew That I wanted to play six. And so even though I wasn't super sold on touring in general, when, when I saw six with Lisa, I, she and I, at the very end of that show, we turned to each other and we were like, you have to play that show. And I'm like, I have to play this show.

I saw it with, um, with Lisa when she was here last June, I believe. 

Yeah. And that was before you got the gig. You have, you have some mojo, I'm telling you, you have. Because when I first met you and we were like, you know, we, we had so much fun playing Lizzie and stuff. We were like talking about, oh, what the next, what the next thing is and trying to get to the next level.

Each of us in our both sort of lanes. Right, right. And then you're like, oh, you know, I mean, you were just thinking about Hamilton and then you got Hamilton. And you, you have, you have, it's like you're, you're. You have an energy that you should sort of put out there and you make your, you, you work really hard for it and you meet and know the right people and you have a great work ethic.

And I just think all of those things come together and you have, I can't wait to see it. Like after this phone call, you're going to get whatever you were thinking about next. 

I hope so. You know. I, I, yes. I, I don't know. I, you, you're right, but also like it's stressful and, but with six, it really, it honestly felt like that because I didn't know anything about six until I saw, I mean, I had heard of it and maybe listened to a few.

I was like a year prior and I was like, Oh yeah, it's cute. I don't know. But then Lisa one invited me to see it, which was amazing. And it was so fun. And it's all female band on stage in costume, which, you know, is my favorite thing. And I just, I saw it and I was like, I have to play this show. And I like.

Yeah, I did everything I possibly could, which wasn't very much. It was just a lot of like wishing and hoping and kind of like, I had, I had reached out to a few people that were maybe kind of involved, but it just, it was like this weird universe thing. Um, and they, they found me, which was, I feel just incredibly lucky for, um, and I was, and I, when I got that call, I said, I will do anything, like whatever.

For this show, I want to play this show. So I'm so just. grateful for that opportunity. Um, but it was, again, it was like the ultimate sacrifice of like, okay, I, I'm leaving the city that I had just committed to and leaving. And I, I had, I'd only been there for like a year and a half at that point. So I was really kind of starting to build momentum and build a community here.

Um, and I left that for this job, which was absolutely worth it, but it really kind of. Hit home when I was away and just being like you said like I've been all over the place and Not having that that home. It really kind of caught up with me And so now I'm like I'm ready to just be here and be settled here For for a while and and I want to build a career here.

I feel like I haven't Really had a lot of time in New York, like looking for work and doing the networking thing and like trying to to truly build a career here, which is harder. There's not as much work here as there is on the road. Um, or like in the Bay Area, I had such a great network and, um, just was able to do so many shows out there, but I'm once again, I'm subbing on Aladdin now again, which is awesome.

And another, um. Amazing gift from the universe. I randomly got an email to music director show It was literally rehearsal started the day I got back from tour So I already knew I was about to leave Tour and I got this email and I said yes to this gig which is a brand new show It's off broadway at this theater called AMT theater.

The show is called on the right track and we actually close in A week and a half, so it's coming to an end, but that was just this other like great thing that that fell into my lap where, um, I got, I had a soft landing back in New York because I had a little bit of work that show, which has been a true blessing.

That's great. See you do have the mojo. Yeah, you're gonna get an email in 24 hours for your next thing. I'm telling you 

Yeah, I mean I love going back and and covering vacation on the tour is really fun it's so you know, we're used to like a show closing and it's just being done and that group has dissolved but For this like that, that shows and you get to go back to it.

Yeah, I get to go back to it. It's so fun. Yeah. Um, and I really totally show can be tough. Yeah. It really is. So that's really nice to be able to still be a part of that family and um, and hopefully I'll get in rotation here, playing that show and then subbing on Aladdin and, um, Yeah, so I, I, I need something else to come along just, you know, to, cause I have time and space for that in my life and I do miss the stability of that's another thing that was cool to have the experience of playing a show eight times a week and like having that steady paycheck and performing every night.

Um, for six months. It was really incredible. And no, I never got sick of it. People always ask that, but this show is so fun to play. And even once it really gets into your body and you no longer have to really think about what you're doing, it's never a negative thing. You're never like, Oh my gosh, I'm playing this show again.

You're always, you're just kind of like. And maybe you're thinking about like where you're gonna have dinner tomorrow or something like that, but you're never like bored. It's always fun. And it's always engaging. And there's a lot of moments on stage with with the cast members and the band that just make it so fun.

And I loved that part of it. So that's 

something I never thought of. You touched on that. It's like, I've never toured, but I've done, you know, regional theater on stage and it's just like, it definitely comes to a close, you know, after six weeks, five weeks or whatever it is. Yeah. Yeah. You're done and you're, it's never going to be remounted again.

It's just not, it's just not built that way. And so a lot of non theater people don't quite understand that. They're like, well, you're going to do it again, right? Or why not take it on tour? Why not just leave it? Why not extend and leave it? Like the regional theater. Business model isn't set up to, for, for extended extensions.

Right. Some, some of them, they're like, there's a window of possible extension if the audiences are there. 

Yeah. If audiences are there. Yeah. But if they're 

not, it's, they move on. Everything goes away and it's shut down. But like, it's. It can be a crushing feeling. Post show blues, they just, even if you didn't like the show, it can still, ugh.

It's just, it's just, it is the polar opposite end of the, Whatever euphoria you might be feeling that right during the show the other end of it is like this kind of like yeah I don't want to use the phrase crippling depression, but it can be rough 

And that's part of the it's part of the beauty of it is like you take on this new identity Yes.

So, you know. Yes. Like, if you're doing a show for like three months or something, it's like, this is the people that you're with, and this is the role that you're playing, and this is the costume that you're wearing, and the music you're singing, and you really are like, okay, this is it. Like, this is The world to you, yeah.

Who I am right now. Mm hmm. And it becomes just such a intimate environment, such an intimate life for everyone involved, and then it just ends. Yeah. And no matter what, yeah, like you're saying, no matter what, you're like, who am I? 

He just closed Blythe Spirit, we were open for five weeks, we did 18 shows, and that show was not 80 Minutes, Katie.

That show was Yeah. Was My math is awful, but it's two hours and 45 minutes of on stage time without intermission. Oh my gosh So three hours in and out eight to eleven. Wow Oh, wow. Um, so all that work for five five weeks 18 shows and then Done. Yeah, it's it's It's it's a tough thing to come down from man It is and yeah, some people are like all that work and then It just doesn't like, yeah, why do you do it?

And like, well, I'm like, I'm sick of answering that question too. 

Yeah. I mean, it's, it's always worth it. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. But yeah. So playing Aladdin, Aladdin has had like eight years. It's been running for something like that. And so before every show, they're like, okay, this is show number 700, something rather.

And that, so there's shows that just run forever. You know, maybe that's different when something like that closes because you really had your time doing it Um, like 

Phantom of the Opera just closed and those right hit musicians Actors that were probably on that people that were attached to that for years They must I mean, I can't even imagine coming down from that.

All right, right That just sounds like an institution just like retired, you know, 

absolutely 

Right, but what I what you brought up that I didn't think of was that tours Broadway runs they have such longer runs and you can come back to them even as a sub you could take six months off And then go back to it.

It's like revisiting a revisiting a friend you're playing again Like you say you're playing a character particularly in six when you're on stage and you feel like you're a part of it Same thing if you're an actor, you're like, yeah I'm gonna go sub back in the show and do join into the woods again or You know, um, how fun, fun that is that, that you, that you have the possibility in touring and Broadway runs that you could go revisit that.

And that's something in regional theater you can, you can never do unless you revisit it in a different production with a different cast and a different director at a different company in a different city and stuff like that. But exactly. 

Yep. That's great information. Well, this was fun. I know. 

Always good to talk to you.

Always great to talk to you, my friend. Thanks for doing this. 

Yeah. Definitely.

Any other burning questions? I don't know. 

I should, should I keep recording? In case we have some, some like serious gems? I'm trying to think. Oh, and that was like an hour. 54 minutes. 

Pretty good. Nice.