How to Impact Community as an Artistic Director with Lisa Mallette

This week we feature the Executive Artistic Director of City Lights, Lise Mallette. Lisa is a truly inspirational, passionate and compassionate leader. In this episode we discuss her career path beginning as a performer, how to find and nurture the audience of your theater company, the gutsy world premiere of a new play about gun violence, and impacting your community through hard conversations, compassion, and empathy.

Find Lisa!
https://cltc.org/
on IG @lisamallette18

Theme music written by Rachel Dean and orchestrated by Katie Coleman

Audio engineer Mike Rukstad

Special thanks to the following folks from the SIX Boleyn Company for lending their voices to the intro:

Mike Rukstad
Dylan Dineen
Sarah Ortiz
Jane Cardona
Kaitlin Ciccarelli
Kami Lujan
Jillian Bartels

Find us!

on IG @howtosucceedintheater
https://howtosucceedintheater.buzzsprout.com

Transcript

00:00.00
howtosucceed
My goodness where to to begin. Um, why don't can you tell me how you your journey to so to finding City lights and your journey at City lights. 

00:20.47
Lisa
You Want to start small, a little warm up. Well the first one journey to City lights is um, sort of a you know? Ah, where did you come From. What were you doing beforehand and really the focus for me was Performance. So Um I I feel like that's important to talk about because I believe that coming um to an organization in the position I'm in now. With an acting background makes me better at these other jobs. So Um I went to acting school I went to 2 actually one that um, focused a little bit more on.

00:57.56
howtosucceed
Yeah.

01:09.57
Lisa
But acting but also musical theater and that was for 2 years it was pcpa the conservatory at pcpa theater fest on the central coast I was born in San Francisco by the way a native and um.

01:18.57
howtosucceed
Yeah, is.

01:23.13
Lisa
Then I went I moved to New York I went to the neighborhood playhouse school of the theater which is the Sanford Meisner technique um and that that school focused um a lot on. Straight acting we still had singing class speech class dance class every day but there were at least 3 hours of acting class every single day and then you were encouraged to meet with your partners and do the exercises outside of school.

01:43.37
howtosucceed
Wow.

01:50.89
Lisa
Um, and then you know I just auditioned for things and I was in things and I got an agent and then this company for a while then that company for a while and then I was lucky enough to get a job in my twenty s that um toured so.

02:09.61
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah, you are doing like one night stops right? So that's a different level to her.

02:09.80
Lisa
Know you know what this is like but I really felt like I was paid to see the country and you know yeah it was a lot of driving. Yeah, it was a lot of driving I mean usually we didn't have to drive on the weekends because this is adults. Performing for young audiences. So we move to a different city every day Monday through Friday and they tried not to have the drives be more than two hundred two hundred and fifty miles if you can imagine after performing that morning.

02:29.75
howtosucceed
Who.

02:46.81
Lisa
Um, but still I was young and spunky and I you know just was so grateful to be able to do the traveling and perform that many shows a week and it just it was great at the time I could never do that now.

03:01.95
howtosucceed
Yeah, oh no, that's not a ah now thing that's a early early in your career. Yeah, nice.

03:07.94
Lisa
Yeah, um, and then there was sort of a natural progression. Um, even though it was ah primarily a performer. There was you know the sort of natural progression of hey would you like to Choreograph this scene or.

03:23.42
howtosucceed
1

03:25.23
Lisa
You seem to be good with people and you've done this show before so instead of being in it would you like to direct it So there's just kind of um, really easy. No decisions to be made really um, but being able to gather more experience in the different lanes and then.

03:41.21
howtosucceed
Yeah.

03:44.93
Lisa
I um, left california theater center I just felt like I had been there for a long time and it was time to try something else and was still working with my agent in San Francisco a member of both the unions and um and then a really close friend of mine that I worked with. At California theater center Tom Goff got this ah job as the artistic director of this little company in San Jose called city lights theater company and um, the ah previous artistic director had been there for years and years and years and Tom was. A part-time teacher at foothill college and so he got in there and you know not a lot of people were paid. It was a pretty low budget. There was a little bit of debt. Um, and he asked me for some advice. So basically he basically said.

04:39.88
howtosucceed
Ah.

04:41.76
Lisa
Will you come and sort of you know, look around and you maybe consult a little bit. You know, give me some advice about policies and procedures around box office or how should we start? you know getting a donor base and well.

04:55.31
howtosucceed
And was he asking you this as a friend like like you were friends and he was like hey friend just come on by or did he know that you had expertise.

05:05.89
Lisa
Yeah, no, he knew he was like you're good at this. You're good at that I feel like you could help with this and I said well I can't do too much for free because I'm looking for work right now and he was like oh yeah, yeah, we'll we'll we'll figure out a way to pay you parttime to just come in and kind of help and figure it.

05:09.70
howtosucceed
Okay.

05:25.58
Lisa
Let's get things pointed in the right direction and honestly I just fell in love with the potential of the organization and I never left and um so the board of directors at the time made me the managing director which felt a little weird because I had you know.

05:26.40
howtosucceed
Great.

05:44.22
Lisa
Artistic background mostly but we Tom and I being friends especially really did everything together. Anyway, you know we both did both things and then in 2004 he was offered full-time position a full-time position at foothill college and so he left and then I was like oh.

05:44.36
howtosucceed
Yeah.

05:51.34
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

06:00.97
howtosucceed
Oh my gosh. Ah you're up. Yeah.

06:03.64
Lisa
So then I ended up staying and it is been 22 years now and I know that's a really long time. Um, and some people are like how could you stay that long and you know the the organization I always felt like I had more to learn more to do. Um.

06:10.88
howtosucceed
Amazing. Ah.

06:22.94
Lisa
And it was growing as I was growing and so I've never felt bored or complacent um in the job and like now we're looking for a new space. So that's a whole nother thing and you know I mean it went from $172000 budget to.

06:33.57
howtosucceed
Right.

06:40.89
Lisa
Basically one point five million and you know be kind of like 1 employee to now 10 fts you know so it's really like a different company.

06:42.80
howtosucceed
Wow.

06:47.78
howtosucceed
So what? What's the the biggest shift in that what caused that amount of money to shift so much was it more shows more staff. Yeah, ah.

06:59.53
Lisa
Um, well honestly, um, okay, this is gonna sound I hope nobody like shuts this off and rolls their eyes but the big booming really like.

07:07.21
howtosucceed
I can edit.

07:14.50
Lisa
Doubling in size Five years came after we did a really solid strategic plan. So for me, the difference was not being constantly in crisis day to day put the fires out but more strategic in the thinking about where.

07:15.52
howtosucceed
You.

07:33.46
Lisa
Where do we want the company to go what does it look like in 5 years and then what are those steps that need to be taken in order to get there so kind of like rising up you know higher altitude of of working and thinking and um the vision for the company to.

07:39.24
howtosucceed
Wow.

07:51.40
Lisa
To me is really the reason why it changed because then you know it it helps you know what you should and should not be doing. You know it's a guide it can if you've got your your values your mission and then say 3 strategic priorities and something pops up and you're not sure if you should do it or not.

07:52.91
howtosucceed
Her. Yeah.

08:09.87
Lisa
And the money on it or not hire somebody for that or not all you have to do is say does it serve these priorities these strategic priorities in order to achieve that vision at the end and if it doesn't your answer should be no.

08:16.50
howtosucceed
Yes.

08:23.89
howtosucceed
Right? That's so great to hear we had a guest on this many episodes ago who basically was talking about that. But for for yourself as an individual artist like what are my goals and and do you know having a strategic plan like. How do I decide if I want to do this show or not does it serve me in those ways so us is over. Yeah.

08:41.54
Lisa
Yes, brilliant brilliant. It took me um, a few years to come to that conclusion that your previous guest did. But I finally did and I was like wait if it's working for the company I could really use a little plan and.

08:54.26
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, ah sure yes prioritizing and I think as artists we tend to say yes to everything too. We're like oh yeah I just got a you know scarcity mindset just got to take everything we can.

09:00.49
Lisa
Ah, vision for my own life. So.

09:11.48
howtosucceed
Get and that's what does not serve us.

09:12.52
Lisa
Yep, yeah, that and that's a rough one to break out of um I I mean I Really I think we've talked about this before but the the way that.

09:18.84
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

09:27.64
Lisa
Theater and arts are set up in this country. You're already sort of needing to push against um some of some of the thought process um of the general public The the whole sweat equity thing the whole. Well you really don't you know you don't need to get.

09:45.58
howtosucceed
Um, um, ours. Yeah oh my God Absolutely ah.

09:45.86
Lisa
Paid that much because it's your passion. You. Love It. You're so lucky to do what you Love. So You don't really need that much money. Do you? You know I know but it's still people still think it in and. So. It's Hard. You know it's a rough rough career choice that's for sure and yet. But you know when people say that I'm like well what do you do for a living and if you don't love it like shame on you like why didn't you find something that you love.

10:01.83
howtosucceed
That's yeah.

10:11.49
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah, and also it's not like we're sitting here making theater and being like oh this is so much fun at all times like it's It's a really hard work. It's really hard work. It's a really hard life and yes, there's.

10:23.40
Lisa
But he. Yes.

10:31.70
howtosucceed
There's passion behind it and emotion behind it. But I don't know it's not like a yeah those and and also I don't think it would be good for people to be rewarded.

10:38.34
Lisa
Yeah.

10:44.89
howtosucceed
More money for how much they hate their job because they're not going to be good at their job if they hate it so it should not correlate shopie that you get paid more the less you like your job.

10:50.40
Lisa
6

10:56.54
Lisa
Ah, yeah I I This is I feel like I've been trying to fight this fight for quite a while. It's like part of the advocacy work that I try to incorporate into my career is just any opportunity. You know, just advocating for art and artists and.

11:13.58
howtosucceed
Me yeah.

11:15.82
Lisa
How how important it is and we are to a healthy society and a happy healthy community I mean I Really believe that in all which is to the bottom of my heart I believe that but it's very you know it's ah it's interesting to find.

11:24.94
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah.

11:34.72
Lisa
Um, how difficult it is to really land that with folks I mean I went to a conference recently and it was for nonprofit leaders in management not just theater but nonprofits and I was you know shocked at.

11:44.63
howtosucceed
Yeah.

11:50.33
Lisa
How many millions of people in the United States are employed ah by nonprofits and how much like what a huge economic engine um nonprofits are I think it's like 7 or 7 point.

12:00.90
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

12:06.75
Lisa
5% of the gdp comes from nonprofits. It's the third largest sector in the country nonprofits in general now I know that that only a piece of that are arts and culture. But um to me that's still a service organization a public benefit corporation.

12:09.46
howtosucceed
Um, oh.

12:12.89
howtosucceed
Okay.

12:19.92
howtosucceed
Let's stay. Yeah.

12:24.70
Lisa
Whether you are providing housing food shelter. Um those types of services I actually believe that art and culture in a community is also providing a service you are serving the community with the art and culture. Yeah, so.

12:39.20
howtosucceed
Absolutely not.

12:43.65
Lisa
Sometimes I'm just amazed that people just think it's all just you know, easy and a big club and then I think you know Also it's part of our job to make it look easy. How would you like to go to the theater and just see how hard it is like you know that's not.

12:49.33
howtosucceed
Ah, right? Oh my goodness.

13:01.87
Lisa
But seems weird.

13:02.80
howtosucceed
That's true. But yeah, that's a really good point. Our job is literally to make you have fun as an audience number so you don't want to see Yeah, that's true. Yeah.

13:09.19
Lisa
Um, yeah, and make it look easy. We're supposed to make it look easy and effortless. That's why it's magical and but it doesn't mean it is.

13:20.30
howtosucceed
And yeah, it's really not um, how have how have the I guess both the audience and the community around you because I think it's fascinating that city life is in the middle of Silicon Valley which is just such a specific kind of place. So how is the community and the audience. Changed in your time there.

13:39.97
Lisa
Um, that's a great question Katie um again I feel like this was somewhat intentional from the city lights from me and the city lights staff and board. But um. We have a younger demographic in general um of audience members than the national average for sure. So at any given time it could be anywhere but depending on a show that's running it could be anywhere between you know, like 35 and.

14:01.72
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

14:14.93
Lisa
50% folks under the age of 45 and the national average used to be 14% then I read something that after after um, um, Hamilton came out because that really spoke to younger people it really.

14:17.23
howtosucceed
Well.

14:31.72
howtosucceed
Um, oh.

14:34.43
Lisa
The percentage of younger people going to the theater went up quite a bit but I think quite a bit means like 17 or 18% not not 35 45% so I think that that I don't think it didn't feel like that when I first started back in 2001

14:40.24
howtosucceed
Yeah, that's interesting. Try.

14:54.20
Lisa
Mean there weren't the there weren't also the audiences were pretty small, um, not always I mean that's a generalization but we really built up an audience base and over the years I feel like the um Demographic has has shifted a bit to um to younger folks.

15:09.62
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah.

15:14.30
Lisa
And I'm extremely proud of that because um and that's intentional like we try to put our I tell everybody that I put myself in other people's shoes for a living and so thinking about like if I were an audience member and I was if I were younger and then I'll ask people that are younger.

15:17.38
howtosucceed
Yeah, that's great.

15:24.19
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah.

15:33.22
Lisa
Would this be fun for you like would you like this or no and so intentionally and strategically we try to make it feel so welcoming for folks so that that the oldfashioned idea of of theater being. Um, for the rich and Elite. You know, really pushing against that that that's not true and um so I really I feel like that you can see that when you come to City lights like you can feel the energy and it's in a converted warehouse if.

15:53.87
howtosucceed
Right.

16:02.80
howtosucceed
Yes. Um, yeah.

16:09.39
Lisa
If no one knows so there is sort of kind of like a casual hip vibe about it anyway and we're looking for a new space right now and I'm hoping to find another warehouse and turn it into a cool theater.

16:13.21
howtosucceed
Yeah, totally right? and you tend to choose shows that that fit that demographic as well. But as you're smart.

16:26.88
Lisa
Yeah I would say at least um I would say I try to make sure that at least 2 2 out of 6 a year really um feature and focus on. Ah stories and characters of that age range. So you know people like to see themselves represented on stage and so what you do when the shows the stories you choose to tell are there's a direct line between the people that are going to want to come and see it.

16:41.42
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah.

16:58.71
howtosucceed
Yeah, right, speaking of that you just commissioned a play about gun violence which I really commend you your choice in doing that and that could not have been an easy thing to decide to do.

16:59.13
Lisa
And support it and those that feel alienated by it.

17:16.68
howtosucceed
So will you tell us a little bit about that show and that experience.

17:20.71
Lisa
Yeah, um, you know some people thought I was crazy. You know we're trying to um, pull out of we I mean the theater world sector is trying to pull out of this pandemic and.

17:29.36
howtosucceed
Community. Yeah, right.

17:36.11
Lisa
And and being shut down for anywhere between eighteen and twenty four months um and you know theaters are closing all over the world. Um, and so to choose something that you know going in is not going to be huge at the box office um is a was it was a risk. Um, but it.

17:49.77
howtosucceed
Right.

17:55.83
Lisa
But it actually wasn't because I knew it wasn't going to be huge at the box office but sometimes there are other reasons to do something and it um and I actually um, didn't commission it really because there was a draft.

18:01.79
howtosucceed
Yes.

18:14.55
Lisa
Beforehand but I worked with kit wilder the playwright to um shape and change it. Ah for the purpose of this world premiere it interestingly enough um came out of um, a college classroom where.

18:23.49
howtosucceed
Got it.

18:34.73
Lisa
Students That's what they wanted to talk about which I find fascinating and and exciting and so um, they worked on that as part of this class and then it was shifted and changed and added to and and subtracted from to become the play that opened this past.

18:38.37
howtosucceed
Wow! yeah.

18:54.50
Lisa
Ah, September but it's called toxic and um, it ah takes place on the 5 year anniversary of a high school shooting um with the people that were there so they come back five years later to the very school to. Try to work through you know, talk about how their lives have been and try to process and maybe be able to in some way shape or form move on from it and um, you know there were so.

19:20.17
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

19:26.80
Lisa
Just fascinating conversations with audience members for this. We had extra talkbacks and I was blown away by how people shared their personal stories of how ah gun violence has touched their lives or the lives of people that they love. It was really touching like there was ah a woman that had worked for the vta in San Jose for many many years and there was a mass shooting there from an employee last year and um, there was another gentleman who lost his mom when he was.

19:45.41
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

19:56.13
howtosucceed
Yeah.

20:03.81
Lisa
Um, a small boy to um, you know it was an accident. It was like I know there's a term for this but but the the police were chasing someone who had committed a crime and she got caught in the crossfire and it was I was so.

20:18.18
howtosucceed
Um, ah oh my god.

20:21.28
Lisa
Touched by how people felt um, open enough to talk about those experiences in the talk path. Yeah yeah, yeah, so I mean a couple of things. The the main reason why I wanted.

20:25.12
howtosucceed
Well to even come to the show at all after experiencing something like that and then talk about it. Wow.

20:39.16
Lisa
To tell this story and and do my part in getting the story out there is because this is the bottom line is there are 400000000 guns in the United States 400000000 and there are 350000000 people and.

20:53.33
howtosucceed
Oh my God oh.

20:57.74
Lisa
There's something wrong with that. So it isn't that I'm all anti second amendment. It isn't that I I mean you know I feel like it maybe is not being used the way it was intended. Originally you know, but um, but it isn't really that it's that people have become so polarized that they can't.

20:58.70
howtosucceed
Right.

21:17.47
Lisa
We as Americans and specifically because the real problem is here have trouble even talking about this about this issue and in the meantime there's just more and more weapons being produced and and purchased so that's really I just wanted the.

21:26.84
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

21:30.40
howtosucceed
Purchase.

21:35.58
Lisa
That to be out there and to create a space where people would talk about it and um, it's gun control that you know we're not saying we weren't trying to say we we should not have any you know what we were saying is like why is it so easy to get them.

21:39.17
howtosucceed
Yeah.

21:53.13
howtosucceed
Yeah, and was that a part of the play that talking about how to easy it is to get guns.

21:55.35
Lisa
It's just so easy.

22:03.20
Lisa
A little bit a little a little bit 1 of 1 of the characters. Um, one of the characters does actually say you're making it too easy. Um.

22:12.11
howtosucceed
You got it. Interesting.

22:15.60
Lisa
And one of the things that that I'm specifically proud of that we did this show was um we I I used the show to um, open a door for me to communicate with our city and county leaders to encourage a.

22:34.64
howtosucceed
Yeah.

22:35.16
Lisa
Gun buyback and um I am not saying that I made it happen but I did engaging conversation and said how can I help how can I support I'd like to tie it into this production if there's any way we can do that.

22:40.49
howtosucceed
Check, yeah.

22:52.59
Lisa
It's really you know the sheriff's department and the city of San Jose and district three and the county of Santa Clara that really ah are you know to be given all of the thanks for this. But it's on December second of this year and so just the fact that it's there if we can pull 1

23:06.82
howtosucceed
Ah, that is so cool.

23:11.56
Lisa
Gun off the streets because of ah that I mean really then then it's all worth it.

23:14.84
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah, and what a great example of how a theater can really change the community I mean you just had this issue that you thought was important to talk about created a play around it.

23:30.12
Lisa
With.

23:32.26
howtosucceed
Put it out there into the community cause discussions and now this is happening. That's what an opportunity and you know it's very commendable.

23:37.26
Lisa
Yeah, yeah, it feels pretty great and pretty feels pretty great. But I think about theater in those terms a lot I mean I I love to be entertained too. So it isn't that everything needs to be Ah, you know a social justice like life lesson.

23:46.92
howtosucceed
Shut me.

23:55.24
Lisa
But when when we theater Makers talk about the power of theater of um, creating empathy and compassion I mean we mean it and so a lot of times I like there's a play that I want to do so bad.

24:05.66
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah.

24:14.10
Lisa
And it has not been available for the rights and royals royalties have not been available yet. But it's basically about an addict trying to get clean and part of the play shows. What.

24:26.79
howtosucceed
Okay.

24:33.49
Lisa
The person addicted Sees feels hears while they're going through detox like while they're going through the withdrawals and if if someone sees that on stage. The.

24:41.47
howtosucceed
Oh Wow yeah.

24:50.50
howtosucceed
Yeah.

24:52.86
Lisa
Then they may be a little bit more compassionate, empathetic, understanding caring when talking to or about or seeing someone who's going through this if they have never gone through it or somebody that they love which I'm find it hard to believe I'm sure many people.

25:04.00
howtosucceed
Right.

25:12.88
Lisa
Know someone? Um, but this this to me that play I believe will help people be more compassionate and possibly change the way they speak to deal. Ah you know with.

25:12.92
howtosucceed
Um, yeah.

25:30.14
Lisa
Laws in place to protect health care anything like that you if you don't understand it if you then it's easier to judge it.

25:30.61
howtosucceed
Um, right.

25:35.39
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and talk about putting yourself in other people's shoes I mean that's what you are doing and then that's what the shows you're doing is doing like telling to the audience put yourself in these this person shoot.

25:50.57
Lisa
Yeah, yeah, yeah, like we had a very successful run of kinky boots over the summer and I never ever got tired of seeing that show because of the message and just accepting yourself and each other and.

25:53.81
howtosucceed
Wow, That's very cool. Yeah I Saw that. Yeah, it's so great. Yeah, right? Yeah yeah, that was such a fun show. I enjoyed it a lot. Um I don't I don't know if it's worth talking about how Covid made it hard.

26:10.28
Lisa
Lifting each other up and I mean who doesn't need to hear that a bunch. Yeah, thank you.

26:26.69
Lisa
My God It's so hard. It's just so hard. People have no idea unless you're in it that if you if you don't have people seeing the shows then then you don't have.

26:28.65
howtosucceed
To Brown At Theater but I know I don't know that that's like interesting is that interesting. Yeah.

26:45.29
Lisa
You're not making an impact in your community. You have fewer audience members to then become donors I mean I'm not even sure if folks know that nonprofit theater is set up to rely on contributed income. That's the business model.

26:59.75
howtosucceed
Um, right? yeah.

27:04.35
Lisa
So if if no one is investing and contributing in that way and you don't have the earned revenue of people coming to see shows and buying tickets and such um, it's it's you know what do you have.

27:21.68
howtosucceed
Right.

27:23.71
Lisa
But sometimes I think like I think like what's the worst thing that can happen if you're running a theater company or you're an artist like what's the worst thing that can happen and it happened Yes, it happened. Yeah so in a way.

27:29.97
howtosucceed
Um, ah ah, ah, a pandemic that shuts shuts everything down. Yeah a Thor ah you survived it.

27:43.58
Lisa
I mean I feel like it. You know we survived it and and and it it makes folks even more resilient I Just we've lost a lot and it made everybody's jobs a lot a lot harder. But I think I told you this that when.

27:59.16
howtosucceed
Ah.

28:00.61
Lisa
Um, when the pandemic first hit the first couple of months um I looked up the word apocalypse. Yeah, and that its root its its root it really means to reveal or uncover.

28:07.19
howtosucceed
Yes I Love this please tell.

28:19.56
Lisa
So it's not as much about the destruction as about what is left. Yeah, so I really took that to heart and and I used it this time as um, ah a really good excuse to question. Everything.

28:21.71
howtosucceed
A world ending. Yeah yeah, yeah.

28:39.41
Lisa
Like what do we want to leave in the pre Pandemic world. What do we want to take with us What would we change? you know that that whole analogy of your backpack like what's in your backpack and we have them like as human beings and also as organizations and I.

28:50.80
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah, here is right like they escape a fire escape backpack. Yeah.

28:58.76
Lisa
Yeah, and you needed to really um, um rethink what was in the backpack and challenge assumptions about the way that we work and the way we relate to each other and so I tried I'm sort of a positive thinker by nature. But I really tried to think this is happening for a reason we.

29:03.35
howtosucceed
Yeah.

29:17.69
Lisa
Have all been sent to our rooms to think about it like a giant time out and so if we don't learn something from it then we will have wasted this crisis.

29:23.90
howtosucceed
Ah, yeah, yeah, right? And and I think everyone uncovered a lot about themselves and their world in that experience.

29:37.73
Lisa
Yeah I agree I agree and and it changed people's priorities a bit. Um, yeah, and so adjustments need need to be made and are being made and you know it really shook us all up.

29:38.82
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah, absolutely oh yeah.

29:53.53
howtosucceed
Yeah.

29:55.45
Lisa
But um, it did make things harder I won't I won't I will I have to admit that it is harder. Um, but you know I guess a lot of things aren't worthwhile if they're too easy.

30:02.00
howtosucceed
Oh yeah, oh yeah, um.

30:07.19
howtosucceed
And like you said now that you survive that maybe things feel a little bit you feel more resilient. Yeah yeah.

30:17.11
Lisa
Um, yeah, it's scary. Not knowing where our next home will be um but I I really believe in my heart in the power of storytelling and art and artists and.

30:27.64
howtosucceed
Yeah, and.

30:32.40
Lisa
I Also believe in my heart that this particular organization this entity which does not belong to me but I have been the leader of for quite some time I believe it it. There's a place for it and it really should continue and provide.

30:41.46
howtosucceed
Oh no.

30:47.95
howtosucceed
Yeah.

30:50.88
Lisa
Um, you know a home for the local artists and continue to do good work and try to change hearts and minds through the work. So at the end of the day you don't always get everything that you think should happen. But I really believe that I really believe that City lights will be okay I Really do.

31:08.94
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah, where right? yeah, speaking of finding a home I think that one thing that City lights has provided for me and for a lot of people is a sense of feeling.

31:10.45
Lisa
And I just don't know exactly what that looks like or when it's your where yeah.

31:24.92
howtosucceed
That you're at home when you're there and I know that so much of that is because of you. So So how how do you create that like if anybody listening is an artistic director or a new or interested in becoming one What are ways that they can make. Cast Members company members audience members feel at home. There. Yeah.

31:45.25
Lisa
Well thank you for saying that Katie I feel like it's your home too and I always want you to come back to it. Um, and that is something that we um hear quite a bit and I love it. You know I love that I hear that I think that um.

31:53.34
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah.

32:02.47
Lisa
I think it goes back to the creating a culture where people feel respected and comfortable and um, like they can be themselves and my staff all feels 100% welcome to.

32:09.27
howtosucceed
Yeah.

32:21.40
Lisa
Pushback on any ideas that I have or go out of their lane and talk about like somebody in marketing has you know it's completely fine and wonderful if they want to talk about something in development or then the facility and that that to me is key because you have to create.

32:22.58
howtosucceed
They feel heard. Yeah.

32:36.33
howtosucceed
Yeah.

32:40.82
Lisa
A space in which people feel that way. Um, before they can feel like they're coming home and we also try to listen to the audience too and we also um, we also make space to interact with them. We have a party after every show So with the intention.

32:41.93
howtosucceed
Right? yeah.

32:55.91
howtosucceed
Yeah.

33:00.24
Lisa
Is to connect the audiences and and the artist in in a more personal but ah 1 on one eye-to-ey relationship buildinging way and that goes back to that thing of not wanting to be an old fashioned sawdusy.

33:08.90
howtosucceed
Yeah, that's great.

33:17.94
Lisa
You know, exclusive elitist theater and if you are if you belong to the people then you sure better be respecting and listening to and and connecting with the people and so I think that has a lot to do with it.

33:20.81
howtosucceed
Ah, right.

33:31.95
howtosucceed
Yeah, that's true.

33:37.10
Lisa
Also I believe as ah, an actor and a director that people do their best work if they feel safe and supported so they can take risks and make mistakes if you will or you.

33:46.87
howtosucceed
He has.

33:52.51
Lisa
You know and that are not even really mistakes. It's just that sometimes finding a character or working on a show you if you try to be perfect too soon Then you're you know you're not really stretching and growing and and finding the the best that you can be. We have to try things that. Sometimes you go too far and then you're like oh I see what that feels like now and so I really believe that um that if if you have a rehearsal room whether an actor or director. Um, where people don't feel they feel safe to make those to. To take chances and risks. Um and they don't feel judged or talked about or you know people are rolling their eyes behind their back like immediately if somebody feels that way then their walls are going to go up and the show is not going to be as good and their performance is not going to be as good.

34:30.91
howtosucceed
Ah.

34:43.61
howtosucceed
Right.

34:45.59
Lisa
And I believe that that's true also running the company. 1 of the big light bulbs for me was things were going pretty well in the rehearsal room and the performances and so I thought why why would I use different a different way of leading in the office than I do and at the end.

35:00.42
howtosucceed
Yeah office right? Yeah right.

35:06.87
Lisa
Like do the same thing and so people feel good about their work. They feel they feel valued and and they have fun I encourage fun? Um, but yet still keeping things professional so they can be internally secretly proud of themselves. You know.

35:22.69
howtosucceed
Write it? yeah.

35:25.22
Lisa
And and I really I find that that I couldn't imagine it not being that way. There's the old fashioned thing of like the artistic director is behind this locked door in this private office making all the decisions and I'm the opposite I'm the opposite? Yeah yeah.

35:32.50
howtosucceed
Ah.

35:39.32
howtosucceed
Sure, yeah, yeah, literally you're part of everything. Yeah, um, okay, 1 question that I should have asked all of my guests. But you're going to be the first one if somebody is looking to have success in theater.

35:45.80
Lisa
Ray.

35:50.56
Lisa
Please.

35:57.42
howtosucceed
What would you say are the top 3 things that they should do or the or maybe the top 3 traits that they should have.

36:09.50
Lisa
Well connected directly to what I was saying about creating that space don't be an asshole like just ever I mean just don't because it's ah it's actually a small community.

36:16.64
howtosucceed
Um.

36:22.59
howtosucceed
Don't yeah.

36:26.67
Lisa
And um, you know be the type of person that other people want to be around and work with collaborative and and and supportive of other people's work and I have this expression where I say lead with your heart not with your ego.

36:32.37
howtosucceed
Yeah.

36:42.38
howtosucceed
Um, yes, yeah, especially in the arts. Yep yeah.

36:42.83
Lisa
Because our egos get in the way so much. Yes, yes, so really like for me. The biggest thing is is it it. It. We all talk to each other and. Like people can tell right away if you're changing the energy in the room because you're not a nice human and I don't mean a people pleaser and I don't mean being Phony I Just mean it's really this business is so much about you.

37:03.92
howtosucceed
Right? Yeah, there's a difference.

37:14.11
Lisa
Honing in your your own craft doing the work that you need to do for your own craft and then relationships it's those 2 things in and who you know and who you talk to and that person that you worked with also then knows this person that they worked with.

37:19.62
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

37:30.76
Lisa
And they're looking for someone that is exactly you and it's because of that relationship building on top of working very hard to build your own skill set and and work on your craft and take that seriously so those I guess those are the 2 that.

37:32.37
howtosucceed
Yeah, yeah.

37:46.34
howtosucceed
Um, right, Those are great. Yeah.

37:49.90
Lisa
2 things. Um, yeah, and the third would be just to always? um, remember to life is short just remember to do your best to enjoy yourself and make sure that your world isn't. All your work.

38:12.92
Lisa
Ah, easier said than done very funny Lisa but.

38:13.45
howtosucceed
Yes, people keep saying yeah, that's funny. How I keep hearing that keep hearing that from everyone ah all right? maybe. Maybe that's possible. No It is possible. What else? do you have in your life that keeps you grounded.

38:30.96
Lisa
And oh goodness dear friends wink wink. Um I have two amazing kids and.

38:40.30
howtosucceed
Um, family. Yeah, you do.

38:48.34
Lisa
Um, I don't even want to talk about how much harder that makes this career like I don't want to go down that little rabbit hole. Yeah, but um I I Really do believe that raising other humans helps you not be selfish.

38:54.75
howtosucceed
That's for next episode.

39:04.90
Lisa
And helps you see the world with a bigger perspective like a bigger point of view because you do see things through their eyes sometimes and then also you are no longer the the star of your own story like you're just not and that's okay, yeah.

39:19.28
howtosucceed
Yeah, ah you can't have that ego anymore. Yeah yeah.

39:24.25
Lisa
Yeah I mean that having kids just really requires a level of it's not about me this decision and in this moment and I don't always get what I want need and desire because this other human actually needs that from me. So um, yeah, sophie or ah, some ah know them as Spencer now. Um, somewhat recently um is twenty and is just my rock. My touchstone.

39:43.78
howtosucceed
Yeah, um.

39:53.28
howtosucceed
Um, good here.

40:03.45
Lisa
Um, and then I have a mini me um, Olivia who's 16 and just ah, you know a bundle just a bundle of of amazing things and they're both. They're both. They're both. Um, so hard to.

40:03.68
howtosucceed
Yeah, um, yeah.

40:13.10
howtosucceed
Okay.

40:22.62
Lisa
You know, but so bring so much joy like seriously, there's so much joy. Yeah.

40:25.49
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, and they both love they both love theater and grew up in the theater and I think that that probably gave them some really great life lessons. Yeah.

40:33.86
Lisa
Yeah I think so I do even though you know I don't think either 1 of them will go into theater as a career and I'm actually quietly relieved? Yeah, but they're both creative.

40:41.26
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, okay thank goodness. Yeah yeah, um.

40:53.45
Lisa
And they're both problem solvers and good communicators. There's so many skills that theater brings that can give people with even if you don't do it for a living I mean that's why it should be in the schools. You know.

41:03.27
howtosucceed
Definitely Yes, yeah, totally Well this has been so great I feel so lucky to even get any time from you at all. So thank you? ah.

41:14.87
Lisa
Okay, so now we have to pick another question and do a follow up a part 2 in a couple months so yeah yeah

41:25.80
howtosucceed
Ah, ah yeah, we should definitely do that. Yeah, we can talk about raising kids or um I don't know how to be how to be an artistic director but great all right. That's jeome.

41:37.17
Lisa
Yeah, well and I'm an executive artistic director too. So I got to know some of that other stuff too. So but um I Ah I Also really ah believe in passing things on mentorship um teaching you know who's who's next.

41:42.30
howtosucceed
Right? That's a good part too. I like that.

41:48.23
howtosucceed
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely you learned a lot we should I should hold on to that information learn from you all right? Well I'm not gonna.

41:54.27
Lisa
Who who's next and what can I if I can I save you from any of the mistakes I made I'll do it. You know.

42:03.60
Lisa
Um, yeah, thank you Katie! Okay, okay, yeah, it was really ah my my pleasure. Really thanks for giving me the time.